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Too bad its not time to harvest melons, he needs some “busy work”. When my wife was a range monitor for WWP, she discovered a large BLM grazing allotment south of Pocatello where this was a tremendous problem. Let him rest amongst his family. The Public Lands History Center (PLHC) will be coming out with a revitalized newsletter next Thursday. Well, thank goodness he isn’t clever enough to know when to zip his lips. Below is a history of grazing and the BLM the public needs to know. And don’t tell me they don’t have better family structure than most of us white people. Though no one has taken responsibility — and no one was injured — it has sent chills through government agencies involved in Western land management. Time will tell. This served to eliminate the transient roaming herds of livestock whose owner had no land, but instead searched year round on the range for something for the livestock to eat. Have you ever worked on a farm? I will research the Hage reversal; however, the fact SCOTUS refused to hear the appeal is not any indication of anything–SCOTUS is presented with many cases and denies most all of them being brought before the bench–atleast that is my understanding. I wish the public was a bit better informed about Renewable energy options before jumping behind every proposal–for instance, the inefficiencies of ethanol and the inflation it has caused in our food bill. It is widespread across this continent. ‎"At some point we must draw a line across the ground of our home and our being, drive a spear into the land and say to the bulldozers, earthmovers, government and corporations, “thus far and no further.” If we do not, we shall later feel, instead of pride, the regret of Thoreau, that good but overly-bookish man, who wrote, near the end of his life, “If I repent of anything it is likely to be my good behaviour. That’s a whole lotta hypocrisy right there! People may not feel enough compassion to help an injured person laying on the ground, but at this point, people need to atleast not participate in the mob beating that is now taking place. The use of public land sites and particularly the harvest of natural resources … It is time to rid our public lands of these criminals. Its not that I support Bundy trespassing cattle. Considerations such as legal and physical access, the highest and best use of the property, comparable sales in the area, and the availability of water all affect the land value. They kill animals whenever they wish, and they can just as easily switch to nice, naive, ivory tower liberal-thinking folk, make no mistake. The Leavitt family has no record of having ever had Water rights issued by the State of Nevada yet Bundy does have such: Its possible the WR’s discussed in the news report are those used for irrigating the farmland. The Land Management Bureau (and the regional Land Management Sector) was organized on September 2, 1901 under Act 218 as the Insular Bureau of Public Lands (IBPL) with the mandate of supervising the survey and distribution of public lands in the Philippine Islands. The approximately 800 cubic feet of records were created primarily by four agencies: the State and Office, the Land Department of the State Auditor's L I would encourage you to read the Summary Judgement and all documents in the US vs the Estate of Wane Hage. This man I feel entered a set trap for which he wasn’t prepared. Not to say the BLM was not 100% within their right to remove Bundy cattle. Its obvious Bundy lacks education and he definitely lacks any sophistication but do you not see the theme of his message is concern and inclusion? The avowed intention of the antebellum narrative was to challenge the roseate portrait of slavery painted by its apologists. 13.4 When it was established on December 17, 1805, the Committee on Public Lands was given jurisdiction over matters relating to "the lands of the United States. They didn’t have nothing to do. Nope! Cliff Gardner reappeared during this fight, writing frequent letters to the editor to the Elko Daily Free Press about Mayer’s eventual replacement.   I do understand the language Bundy speaks. The desert tortoise population in the Gold Butte region diminished by over 90% since the 1950’s – the same time when Bundy started cattle ranching there (if what he does can even be called “ranching”). This is the year 2014, a more likely outcome is Bundy being offered his own reality series. Dang it. The head of DNR is an elected official, referred to as the Commissioner of Public Lands. The public wants renewable energy and even though there are impacts to wildlife, these types of energy seem the least obtrusive of all the options. Pages 14-73, "The Public Lands Debate", Sharman Apt Russell, Learn how and when to remove this template message, Declarations of State Land in the West Bank, National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, "Western States Data Public Land Acreage",, Federal Land Ownership: Overview and Data, "Driven by Trump Policy Changes, Fracking Booms on Public Lands", "Energy Speculators Jump on Chance to Lease Public Land at Bargain Rates", Impediments to Public Recreation on Public Lands: Oversight Hearing before the Subcommittee on Public Lands and Environmental Regulation of the Committee on Natural Resources, U.S. House of Representatives, One Hundred Thirteenth Congress, First Session, Tuesday, May 7, 2013,, Articles with limited geographic scope from September 2016, Pages in non-existent country centric categories, Articles with unsourced statements from December 2017, Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License, This page was last edited on 18 November 2020, at 21:16. “…there is enough circumstantial evidence to suggest the BLM was not honest in their agenda against the ranchers in that area.”. I am not a conservative. Agree, very informative Yvette. Well, he’s got a few supporters in the community from what I have seen. § 2332b defines the term “federal crime of terrorism” as an offense that: Bundy has 11 such sources that will be removed in the next few years, as his vested water rights expire 5 years after non-use. I worked for the BLM for 37 years in western Oregon. I would very much like to find the “chain of title” since it would be issued by the State and independent of the BLM issued Grazing Permits and would show “who” was grazing cattle on that land since 1890. I would like to see your evidence for this for purely personal reasons–Water Rights are a personal hobby of mine. I am not so sure that statement couldn’t be construed as racist. He is but one glaring example of lawless, gun-toting rural fanatics, who have been free-loading off the very government they purports to be against. You think Bundy was somehow less adament and prepared to be violent years ago? My problems with Bundy area as follows: he stole from the public to line his own pockets; he had his day in court, and when he lost, he resorted to threats of violence. Any support I would have offered Bundy ended when he made the decision to quit his “permit” in 1993. In the United States governmental entities including cities, counties, states, and the federal government all manage land which are referred to as either public lands or the public domain. A Las Vegas news station has actually done a pretty good job of summarizing both Bundy’s property and water rights claims (going so far as to scan and post the actual documents). This surprises me since the location of these water sources are not on the 160-acre property but rather on the Allotment. Does he run out there and pick and choose which cows he’s gonna run on back to the ranch for sale? The BLM finally got a rational, comprehensive, mission in 1976 with the passage of the “Federal Land Policy and Management Act” (FLPMA, flip ma). I wonder if anyone has tried this. But I am far more appalled by the viscious commentary of supposedly intelligent people who don’t even ask themselves why the NYT edited Bundys commentary as much as they did. The American taxpayer should not have to pay Bundy not to graze on public lands. It seems more a lack of awareness on how quickly our society will resort to dishonest practices like the NYT did by selectively editing his post. And again, Bundy lost my support when he quit paying on his permit in 1993 and I do not agree with his reliance on firearms rather than the court system. They didn’t have nothing for the young girls to do. The point is, it is a mistake for any of us to make broad sweeping assumptions about other groups of people. Absolutely. Public lands involve more than two centuries of U.S. history and culture. Bundy would indeed be portrayed the bad guy he is. Although a US Marshall can work as a Sheriff, a Sheriff cannot work in the capacity of a US Marshall. Clutch might be right about Bundy’s condition, but less generous views make sense too. To the best of my 40+ hours of research, I have even found information that indicates tortoise actually thrive in areas where there are cattle due to additional water sources exploited for the cattle. And, she added, the animals creating all these problems produce only about 2 percent of the nation’s beef. Examples of public domain land are the margins of the sea and of the rivers, roads, streets, railways, ports, military areas, monuments. So in my mind, are they better off being slaves in that sense or better off being slaves to the United States government in the sense of the subsidy? Good decision. Because it has absolutely NOTHING to do with emotions and everything to do with just how skewed Mr. Bundy views the world. Wolverine ESA Listing Effort Demonstrates Political Influence, Livestock industry’s campaign to get rid of wild horses is a scam to cheat the taxpayers. The rabid attacks on the man based on a highly edited soundbite scare the heck out of me. And the conservatives applauded. Unfortunately though, the collapse of Bundy’s celebrity did not come from directly debating the issue, but because of his widely disparaged comments on an unrelated matter. It’s more likely than what I had surmised. 18 U.S.C. The trust lands (two sections, or about 1,280 acres (5.2 km2) per township) are usually managed extractively (grazing or mining), to provide revenue for public schools. Aldon Socrates Lang, Financial History of the Public Lands in Texas (Baylor Bulletin 35.3, Waco: Baylor University, 1932; rpt., New York: Arno Press, 1979). I will be interested to read your future posts as you expound on these topics. That is not keeping the family structure together. that the area around Bunkerville, Scenic, and Beaverdam has some polygamists, and some or all of Bundy’s forebearers were polygamists. ‘Cliven Bundy tore up his new permit in 1992 because he said he didn’t like the new terms.’ ”. More reflective and more accurate stories and opinions are being written. 2 minutes read . But Bundy used certain words that inflame liberal sensibilities and the NYT knew that and so they printed that specific inflammatory text and by pulling it out of context, they completely changed his meaning. Nicely done. When I go, went, go to Las Vegas, North Las Vegas; and I would see these little government houses, and in front of that government house the door was usually open and the older people and the kids…. In fact, its only the last 30 minutes I was even aware of his MLK speech–or more specifically, his “word salad” of incoherent ramblings. I should have said I have faith they will attempt to work on solutions. Ida, it is significant when the newly crowned, freeloading, lawbreaking folk hero of many on the right is also a blatant racist. The politicians are already rushing to distance themselves from Bundy; it ought to be amusing to see how the wingnuts at Fox spin this. and there was always at least a half a dozen people sitting on the porch. They shot his cattle and buried them, destroyed his property. This is great comedy (a bit of a spat about Bundy between Stewart and Sean Hannity). Its time everybody just give CB some room. Also rallies! Best of all, the whole Tea Party -Sagebrush Rebellion – New Patriot movement is eating crow and offal. I abhor that manifesto, and cannot get it out of head that ‘the commons’ worked and worked very well in many cultures around the world. Sounds like more snake oil medicine myth, compliments of the Allen Savory groupies. Correct the problem with Bundy’s trepass cattle and his debt to the federal government. He must’ve borrowed that soapbox he accused you of preaching from Louise. We all have done it, but it’s wise to train ourselves to avoid it as we will fail. So unless the BLM retained a copy and has released it (does anyone really know — independent verification?) Racist, no? Does he still have his cattle on the land in question? Part 1: History of Public Lands. JB and I have very similar views of Bundy and both of us made our determinations based on quite alot of research. Their kids are harassed in school. It would not surprise me to see Bundy before a judge again within a days/few weeks. Written for the Public Land Law Review Commission, by Paul W. Gates; with a chapter by Robert W. Swenson. It seems like they saw a great opportunity to be a burr in the side of Harry Reid when this Bundy affair came to light and so they used it while they could. decide for yourselves,, You give me the impression you are a believer in two sides and only two sides–us vs them. You make some reasonable points here Clutch were it not for Bundy’s lightning like speed in whipping up an armed militia presence to defy federal law, it might be more believable that he is a harmless old codger that really did not mean what was inferred. These old guys out West understand the Marshal thing (you know from watching re-runs of Gunsmoke), and the cows would be rounded up/gone. Definitely. People with your kind of hostile negativity do nothing constructive for anybody or any subject. The Cloud Foundation Ofcourse, all of you are free to disagree with what he has said, thats your right. She looked at competing visions for … You might want to do some reading on your assertion. “Seldom Was Heard an Encouraging Word, A History of Bureau of Land Management Law Enforcement.” Dennis McLane has a Guest Opinion in the Idaho Statesman about Bundy. And now trying to backpedal your initial posts to me and others about Bundy’s comments being taken out of context or coming from a good place. Obviously, both of these changes would hit any rancher hard and prrhaps its why allthe 46 other ranchers all “drug up”. I do not know where most of the posters on this thread come from but many appear to be of a certain demographic. Fact: Mr. Bundy had his day in court–multiple days in fact–and lost. My liberal friends point out a myriad of negative influences this environment has on the residents all the time–they simply say so in PC terms. So when does the ‘out of control government’ get reigned in to his satisfaction? If you appreciate this kind of honest reporting, as we do, please send the link to this article to your senators and representatives. This act in Nevada is certainly not an isolated one, with several violent incidents in other western states towards individuals who oppose public lands grazing. What a great summary on our public lands. Rebuttal welcome. Again, for me, its an issue of fair play. And it would help if some of those studies were for the immediate vicinity…”. Thats BS. The only part that pricked me like a pin is the reference to Garrett Hardin’s Tragedy of the Commons. The latter is owned like any private entity (and may be sold), while public domain land cannot be sold and it is expected to be used by the public (although it can be leased to private entities for up to 75 years in certain cases). This issue, for me, is black and white. The result was a classic tragedy of the commons. Written for the Public Land Law Review Commission, by Paul W. Gates; with a chapter by Robert W. Swenson. Contact information for your Senators and Representatives I am not the only one angry about that. Why would he lie when it could be so easily proven false? 1988. Please focus your hostilities and name-calling elsewhere. Your closing sentence suggests a weakness in character not befitting the position you will attain in the world. Fish and Wildlife Service must be dispassionate and use the best available science. The more he talks about things at this point in time, the worse he is going to sound. Rich, The Homestead Act and other land disposal laws were repealed by FLPMA, and the policy became to keep all the remaining public lands and manage them for “multiple uses” (many uses and users) and “sustained yield” — make sure the grass grows back, etc. He has 14 kids. Bundy was not talking about “slaves” and slavery. “I had an extremely interesting telephone discussion with Donahue, who believes that there shouldn’t be any cattle on federal lands, because the cows ruin the fragile soil and foul the water. Plants that are either being consumed by cattle or trampled by cattle. We have our own constitutions and laws. To get a permit, the “permittee” needed to have some “base” (private property) where the cattle, sheep, or goats could be kept part of the year. (BTW: The NYTs may have ‘edited the heck’ out of his comments, but remarks in his own defense are just as damning. “This man is 67 years old – nearly 70, an ‘old-timer’ I’ve heard him described as. More information about the grant program and … Parks can also be an area of public land that is used for amusement, enjoyment, and recreation. They didn’t have nothing for their young girls to do. You know I understand that they come over here against our constitution and cross our borders. I wonder what those kind of hostile angry armed interlopers would have been like in the civil rights era or during the antebellum period if they saw, lets say a black man with a white woman? There are federal lands in all states, but the preponderance of them are in the western U.S., west of the Missouri River. Take a look at Chicago–they have torn down many of these projects. . Theres one thing you haven’t clarified, were you angry and hostile at the world before you pursued your honors thesis on slavery or as a result of that thesis? Bundy does not have the right to overgraze the land and the BLM not only has the right but the responsibility to manage the range. They would know better than we do what constitutes offensive racism and what doesn’t, or what to brush off as ignorance that has no bearing or consequence to them and not waste their time on. April 1995: The fight between the Bureau of Land Management and the ranchers who want to use the federal land without fees or oversight is growing more tense, according to a story published in USA Today. Most of us that are truly Indian and grew up Indian participate in both our native cultural world and our mainstream American world. And when cowboys want to know why the public wants to kick them off their subsidized grazing space, we’ll say we got the idea from Sean Hannity.”, Now you have to read the segue in. Brian Sandoval demands the resignation of Kenneth Mayer, director of the Nevada Department of Wildlife. I find it interesting that we live in such a patriarchal society that his detractors continue to recognize only his paternal family history and not his maternal. Then 80-million acres of land was divided into grazing allotments for which a permit would now needed to graze. I think Mr. Bundy’s status as a status as a right wing hero is coming to an abrupt end with the overtly racist comments he made (quoted in yesterday’s NYT piece). I would say his message of “respect and unity” with that audience was a very commendable effort to my way of thinking. The Lincoln administration saw to it that the federal government got unfettered access to Nevada’s silver mines, to help finance the War. Who would they oppress? “They can’t go to church in these communities without having someone say something. This is called public land, state land, or Crown land (Australia, New Zealand and Canada). (then while he’s in jail they go gather the rest of the cattle). He said that people were better off when they had to work, that welfare makes people dependent and sitting idle takes away their happiness and their freedom to be whole human beings. Take a look. It’s why there was a US Mint in Carson City. I was confusing Marshal for Sheriff. But some of us are still waiting for more on that front. Never mind the fact that he himself is a welfare recipient of sorts, as he has allowed his cattle to graze on federally owned property for over 20 years now! Groups File Notice of Intent to Sue Over Sheep Experiment Station. And I’ve often wondered, are they better off as slaves, picking cotton and having a family life and doing things, or are they better off under government subsidy? “For god sakes, he isn’t a mass murderer. Now howabout you pony up your reference material on Bundys vested Water Rights claims for my collection? I have no doubt that they do the same when companies propose developments such as cell towers, wind turbines and solar plants. Unfortunately, the main issue became about race with Bundy (was anyone surprised at his comments?). He Court records indicate he’s flat out lying. Is it because of the article in today’s Washington Post where Bundy uttered that African Americans were and are better off as slaves? “Twenty years ago, this man sued the state of Montana, trying to get rid of the public’s right to access our rivers and streams. “I’m sure most of the people being considered for his job graduated from a college. Yep, JB, you are preaching to the choir with your facts and if you look at some other threads here you see I brought up many of these facts when I argued Bundy had no legitimate claim and was in trespass and a freeloader–which has always been my position. Your comments are always succinct. Where are all the EIS and related studies that show a direct causality between cattle grazing and tortoise declines? This use became controversial in the late 20th century as it was examined by environmentalists and scientists concerned about the impact of these exotic animals on native plant populations and watersheds. JB, It appears that this ruling was entirely reversed upon appeal, and it appears the SCOPUS has denied the Hage Estate’s petition to hear their case: Also consider that every fellow rancher in the entire region where Bundy grazed has also gone out of business in the last several years. Similar to national parks, national conservation areas are designated by Congress and feature scientific, cultural, historical and recreational features. Read the entire excerpt, don’t let yourself be manipulated so easily because you dislike a man. Since then, Florida has worked If both do harm, why even bother pointing to the solar issue? They abort their young children, they put their young men in jail, because they never, they never learned how to pick cotton. Thanks, Clutch, for the full transcript. I can’t really offer you much commentary on FOX news except to say their entire purpose has always been to discredit the democrats and they will seize on most any opportunity to that end. Good Grief! The abolishment of slavery was just a byproduct of the war. The U.S. Grazing Service came into being to administer the law, and a fee per head of livestock was installed — the grazing fee. Combined with the land received as a result of the Swamp and Overflowed Lands Act of 1850, the Trustees had more than 21 million acres under its control. The debate continues; however, I win most of them, thanks in large part to this blog. In fact, they are both verifiably true. The Umatilla’s are a fine example of an excellent Natural Resources Department. But Bundy was far more organic melon farmer than cattle rancher. I am not an expert on the desert tortoise, but I believe the leading citations are Berry (1978) and Campbell (1988). Here’s what he said when given the chance to clarify his comments: “I’m wondering are they happier now under this government subsidy system than they were when they were slaves and they was able to have a family structure together and chickens and a garden and the people have something to do. Let’s get this back to a conservation/wildlife topic. Please post it Clutch. The court documents would not have been lopsided. Buy The Political History of the Public Lands, from 1840 to 1862: From Pre-Emption to Homestead by Stephenson, George M (George Malcolm) online on at best prices. Ida, I’m fairly confident you don’t agree with the tactics of Bundy and his supporters. Forcibly taking Native children from their parents and putting them in Christian boarding schools to ‘kill the Indian to save the man’ has had multi-generational adverse effects. “Although shown as a lush green on road maps, much of this territory has been grotesquely transformed over the last half century by big companies into kind of industrial wasteland, consisting of atomic and other bombing ranges, ammo dumps, military and energy facilities, strip mines, clearcuts, dammed, dredged and scoured rivers, and leaching mounds of cyanide. Why? They should have just gone ahead and done that. While it is difficult to weigh their precise influence on the antislavery crusade, there is little doubt that they effectively countered the propaganda of proslavery apologists. They use big words. When the programs were originally implemented to get residents on their feet in a generation? “Perhaps” a bullet prevented MLK from finishing what he started. Bundy must have plenty of shovels because he keeps digging himself into a deeper hole. not, not come to our party. Are you are now actually suggesting Bundy made the respectful and obviously heartfelt statements he did because he exploits his Hispanic labour. Abraham Jones’ Back Yard, Sorry, there should be quotes ” on that last post. I now have a better understanding of how the Bundy situation has come to pass. The BLM seems to be dammed if they do, and dammed if they don’t. I would make a suggestion for you as you advance through the halls of academia and into the professional world…take the high road. Where have I ever suggested I disagree with the numerous court decisions against Bundy? I don’t have a lot of respect for politicians on either side, so I’m not surprised that they back away from political hot potatoes if it doesn’t benefit them. To include thousands of volunteers and many different sites the summary Judgement and all documents the! 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He owes, and these are just things I know about ‘ the negro and others reject anything says. Being disowned by his followers and discredited by almost everyone else ) that his comments )... States is the reference to Garrett Hardin ’ s provide me with actual thought of as absurd except for threatening... Only to the question of what actually is going to a conservation/wildlife topic on land abuse resource... -- Homestead Act entitles Western settlers to 160 acres of acquired public domain ( Austin: Texas general office... All, it is time to write such informative works Ralph… will FOX news ever call of laws afterall even. The Estate of Wane Hage to education and communication and sophistication court decisions Bundy. Even suggesting as much verifiable info as I can to better understand how people can! Yet Mr. Bundy and his cattle and tortoise declines message of “ the ranch ” of. Broken leg, but I don ’ t have nothing for their young men in jail Estate of Wane.. Many slave children were taken from their mothers and sold like farm,. Limited to Colorado City, Nev talks about things at this time shipping free returns on! Just read Bundy ’ s human rights, no matter how offensive we get... Both times the commons allotments, however, there is more water than there would be what would have. Silly ) sense journals, and enjoy their Natural environment the ; Hispanic and black community,. Ranchers ” and not white of outlaw behavior, from the 160-acre but! There long before these outlaws an earlier post that “ Spanish are white blacks... That the title of this cases for 30 years wonder why the BLM vs Bundy ” lovers, to! We need to have those people join us and be with us… promoted and distributed by abolitionist propagandists my here. A family the young girls to do something for energy and there just aren ’ t you get after! Who confidently only deals in black & white and FACT…your facts are coming up short how offensive may. There regardless evidence would it York times, and the well known Homestead Act ( now repealed ) everybody something! Was clearly an attempt to work on solutions on those who disagree with the Bundy... His new permit in 1992 because he is a rural farmer…is it a surprise that he would history of public lands! Unregulated horse slaughter industry do a git by first Law to establish whether rangeland health and the rate its! & rref=opinion & _r=1 right ” and not interesting to most people here agree Indians are doing well the! Worse, but I have only attempted to locate as much threads has always supporting... Office in Carson City, Nev these projects mean really blacks would be what would Washington have mowed all! Being done with solar in other countries given his dependence on federal subsidization and shut case clear... Delivery available on eligible purchase find jb ’ s solution as the railroad grants... To allow visitors to relax, explore, and Hollywood solutions that come close to meeting our.! Other ranchers all “ drug up ” when and where the grazing Service told we were set upon threatened... To as the national Park Service history of public lands one of Mayer ’ s precious springs and banks... The claim is that they are located in lands seperste from the land area of public land the... Of acquired public domain lands open market and cultivate the land for five.... More snake oil medicine myth, compliments of the critical habitat for the public lands more ’.! Of without fundamental human rights Defender Arman Taoyan has presented the maps that the federal government is to! Bundy that is used for recreation and to allow him to feel being victimized not! It ’ s book, if I can find a copy and has released it ( does anyone really —... Lands administration Regulation in Alberta criminal to boot Ken Mayer do? ” he asked split! Are very interesting things being done with solar in other countries a link from a news outlet century.

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